Wednesday, July 29, 2009

Is JP delusional?

I was actually surprised to see the video of the debate between Shmuely Boteach and Christopher Hitchens in JP’s latest post. I think that Boteach does a decent job defending Judaism, but less so theism in general. Although Hitchens powerfully argues for atheism, I feel that Hitchens’ militant anti-religious stand is not helpful and distracts from the important message, which should be about humanistic morality. Hitchens fails to distinguish between purely religious tenets and culture or customs that accompany people who practice religion. Just as any people have customs and practices peculiar to them, so do Jews, and they shouldn’t be faulted for that. This assumes that we consider Jews as a nation or a people, not just people who practice the religion. Furthermore, he does indeed use straw man arguments against Judaism, using marginal/extremist positions or Biblical era Hebrews as representing what Judaism is today. This would be like dismissing modern day European culture or values because of slave trade from 200 years ago. Jews and Judaism evolved, just as other cultures have, and we don’t need to be taking shit for what we presumably did to Amalek 3000 years ago.

Having said that, I cannot help myself but laugh out loud at how JP twists the meanings of words in a pathetic attempt to accuse others of what he is guilty. For example, throughout his posts, JP repeatedly attempts to discredit atheism by calling its proponents drug addicted sex fiends and Nazi holocaust deniers. This would be classic ad hominem—attacking the character rather than the idea. But JP, with breathtaking idiocy, tries to use this term to refer to our asserting the fact that, in comparison to modern times, ancient man understood little about the world around him and had poor awareness of history given the lack of writing. Since many aspects of religion involve history and nature, early man’s ignorance of these subjects obviously affects the reliability of his knowledge and insights into the world, including religious insights. They weren’t stupid, they were just ignorant and therefore unreliable historians. This isn't an ad hominem attack, its just history.

So take your pick. JP is either an idiot or delusional.

According to Wikipedia, the definition of “argument from ignorance”:

A logical fallacy in which it is claimed that a premise is true only because it has not been proven false, or is false only because it has not been proven true. The two most common forms of the argument from ignorance, both fallacious, can be reduced to the following form:

• Something is currently unexplained or insufficiently understood or explained, so it is not (or must not be) true.
• Because there appears to be a lack of evidence for one hypothesis, another chosen hypothesis is therefore considered proven.

I think that this pretty much summarizes JP’s argument for his Judaism. Since Hitchens drinks, atheism must be wrong, and therefore JP’s ultra-extreme fundamentalist Judaism must be right.

5 comments:

G*3 said...

> Jews and Judaism evolved, just as other cultures have, and we don’t need to be taking shit for what we presumably did to Amalek 3000 years ago.

Except that Judaism is supposed to be made of timeless truths. And ths slaughter of Amalek was commanded by God, Who presumably doesn;t change. So we are serving a genocidal Being. Also, Parshas Zachor is still an obligation today, as would be killing Amalekites if we knew of any.

> For example, throughout his posts, JP repeatedly attempts to discredit atheism by calling its proponents drug addicted sex fiends and Nazi holocaust deniers.

This is his fall-back tactic. According to him the only reason anyone disagrees with him is becuase they're sleeping around while high. If only skepticism was really that much fun.

DrJ said...

"Except that Judaism is supposed to be made of timeless truths"

Obviously it isn't.

JP would be the perfect straw man for Hitchens, but fortunately, JP doesn't represent either authentic Judaism or 99.9% of Jews. You can barely call what he spouts Judaism.

E-Man said...

So the whole amalekite thing is immoral? Is it immoral to defend one's self from harm. The nature of Amalek, according to the bible's description is that they will try to kill Jews whenever possible. Was it immoral for israel to take out Egypt's airplanes before they could use them to kill Israelis in the 67' war? This is the same idea by amalek, they try to kill Jews whenever possible therefore we should get them before they get us. Is that immoral?

G*3 said...

> The nature of Amalek, according to the bible's description is that they will try to kill Jews whenever possible.

Killing people because of a stereotype is immoral. Is it really rational to claim that there is something in the physical makeup of Amalek that makes them hate Jews? Even among the Pelestinians, who are raised in a culture of hatred towards Jews, there are a few moderates.

> Was it immoral for israel to take out Egypt's airplanes before they could use them to kill Israelis in the 67' war?

No, but it would have been immoral if Israel had gone on to wipe out all Egyptains, men, women, and children. There is a huge difference between striking millitary installations and slaughtering civilians.

DrJ said...

Regarding Amalek , it certainly was considered
moral then, but not by current standards. Just
like beheading was considered humane and moral
200 years ago but not now.